Joms members at the races

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Joms members at the races

Postby Michael » Fri Apr 22, 2016 3:58 am

L to R. Larry Roberts, Jack Cavanaugh, Tom Brockmeyer, Shawn Cavanaugh.

have fun guys icon_thumbup.gif
IMG_20160421_102656_055.jpg
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Re: Joms members at the races

Postby 1500J » Fri Apr 22, 2016 4:06 am

The Usual Suspects

8-)
60-66-76-89-93-99
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Re: Joms members at the races

Postby Fastjeff » Fri Apr 22, 2016 10:58 am

Seen those faces before--at the Post Office!

Jeff
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Re: Joms members at the races

Postby Dave Mckinney » Fri Apr 22, 2016 5:26 pm

want to see more pics please icon_clap.gif
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Re: Joms members at the races

Postby Tom Brockmeyer » Sat Apr 23, 2016 3:55 am

Eli Campbell got here today... LarryR (grandpa) picked up Eli & his mom at the Savannah, GA airport this afternoon.

Great kid, and I'll see him race for my first time tomorrow.

The race site has very limited cell coverage (& no Internet) so I will try to upload pictures tomorrow nite.

Tom
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Re: Joms members at the races

Postby zul8tr » Sat Apr 23, 2016 8:28 am

Michael wrote:L to R. Larry Roberts, Jack Cavanaugh, Tom Brockmeyer, Shawn Cavanaugh.

have fun guys icon_thumbup.gif
IMG_20160421_102656_055.jpg



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Re: Joms members at the races

Postby Michael » Sat Apr 23, 2016 8:07 pm

Eli's race starts in a few min.

IMG_20160423_142949_182.jpg
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Re: Joms members at the races

Postby Fastjeff » Sat Apr 23, 2016 8:31 pm

Good luck!

Jeff
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Re: Joms members at the races

Postby Michael » Sun Apr 24, 2016 12:00 am

Eli won the J hydro race    icon_clap.gif
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Re: Joms members at the races

Postby Fastjeff » Sun Apr 24, 2016 12:04 am

YES!

Jeff
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Re: Joms members at the races

Postby Fingerlakeskid » Sun Apr 24, 2016 12:30 am

Way to go Eli !!!!!
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Re: Joms members at the races

Postby Steve77t » Sun Apr 24, 2016 12:46 am

You mean runabout as that is the boat pictured.
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Re: Joms members at the races

Postby Michael » Sun Apr 24, 2016 1:53 am

Eli runs a couple boats
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Re: Joms members at the races

Postby JimWildgen » Sun Apr 24, 2016 2:13 am

Very cool you guys, nice to see those young drivers out there!  What fun!
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Re: Joms members at the races

Postby Tom Brockmeyer » Sun Apr 24, 2016 3:22 am

Back at the hotel for the nite now and I will report on Eli tomorrow nite with final results.

I've been to LOTS of races and seen lots of kids getting started;  Eli is in good hands!  Our JOMS member, LarryR is a great Crew Chief, fast learner and very thorough.  Eli is a great listener, drives like a seasoned veteran, and did not hesitate to speed through a stiff headwind today while two boats floated up and one blew over (J hydros DON'T blow over often!)  I'm pretty proud to have helped out Larry & Eli today.

Our other Father/Son JOMS members, Shawn & Jack Cavanaugh from Maine (FastJack on JOMS) are already well established in racing and I've seen them nearly every year at this race. If Jack stays at racing after he graduates High School, he will be a longtime top contender in APBA.

Tom
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Re: Joms members at the races

Postby Genel » Sun Apr 24, 2016 3:47 am

Looking good Eli! icon_thumbup.gif
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Re: Joms members at the races

Postby bh/ » Wed Apr 27, 2016 12:43 am

-some resultzs from Jesup ;
Eli had a good weekend !
bh/

   JR
   Nathan Pittman
   Eli Campbell
   Nathan Kowalski
   TJ Long

   2nd Day

   JH
   Eli Campbell
   Sam Tennell
   Nathan Kowalski
   Cameron Lupton

   2nd Day

   AXR
   Kelsey Bennett
   Rylan Chew
   Eli Campbell

   2nd Day

   AXH
   Rylan Chew
   Noah Romberg
   Eli Campbell
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Re: Joms members at the races

Postby LarryR » Thu Apr 28, 2016 2:28 am

Yah, Eli took four prizes at Sunday AM drivers meeting.  He was pretty pumped.
Sunday's results were similar
JSR  1st
AXH 3rd
AXR 3rd
JSH 2nd

He did much better in AXH, though the result was the same.  Six boats and the two guys out front were, older, wiser and faster.
The kid that beat him is JSH made H U G H improvement over Saturday.  He was fast, but a better start might have beaten him for another first for Eli.
He's just a little kid (Sam) and looks a lot like Quin.
Eli had trouble getting on plane in AXR and started 25-30 boat lengths back of third place, but with patience, he reeled him in near the end of lap 2 and got the 3rd.
Total weekend haul - 2300 points!

We use two engines and two boats to run four classes.  At Tabor City, we ran four classes with the same two boats and one engine - playing musical restrictor plates.  Couldn't have managed it without Eli's mom.  A great pit lady.
At Jesup, Tom was a great help, allowing me more time to prepare for the next heat while Tom tended to immediate needs.

Now, let's talk about the planing problem.  We use the same engine for AXR and AXH.  No problems with planning AXH.  No recent internal engine changes.
The AXR takes more effort/power to plane, although has never been a problem.
1st heat, no problem
2nd heat, engine low on power for about 20-sec, then you could hear it gaining revs and noise.  Popped up quickly.  Tom thought one cylinder was flooded.
3rd heat, same result, but maybe 40-sec low on power.
4th heat, similar result but several minutes low on power, about 1/3 of the course, then gradually you could hear it pick up all the way across the lake and Eli had a long haul to catch the 3rd place boat.

Thoughts on the stator - this engine has a CDI stator and switch box - this stator has only one coil, unlike the merc unit.  No load voltage from stator 295-V - finestkind - haven't tested it under load.  possible, but not easy to do.  I've ordered new stator and switch box from CDI.

Any thoughts, hints or other advice from you folks would be good.    Standish, ME in 25-days!   Quin's first try at JSH!  Cheers!
little merc shop, Londonderry, NH; 1946 thru 1961 merc restoration :)
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Re: Joms members at the races

Postby Fastjeff » Thu Apr 28, 2016 1:58 pm

Sounds like it might be a bit rich on jetting (and loading up).

Jeff
Words spoken in two stroke heaven: There's no fuel like an oiled fuel.
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Re: Joms members at the races

Postby LarryR » Thu Apr 28, 2016 3:05 pm

It's got the same .068 jet that every other AX has.  It'll be worth it to check the float level though.
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Re: Joms members at the races

Postby Fastjeff » Thu Apr 28, 2016 3:26 pm

Two jets and two PHs can act very differently.

Jeff
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Re: Joms members at the races

Postby LarryR » Fri Apr 29, 2016 1:37 am

This one ran flawlessly with this jet all last year.
I plan to pop the carb off and check the inlet needle float height tomorrow AM.
While it's off, I'll take a peek at the reeds.
little merc shop, Londonderry, NH; 1946 thru 1961 merc restoration :)
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Re: Joms members at the races

Postby daveswaves » Fri Apr 29, 2016 1:47 am

larry while its off check the needle and seat as well.  I have had a seat come loose from vibration and flooding results
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Re: Joms members at the races

Postby ctpdsr » Fri Apr 29, 2016 4:14 pm

Looks like fun! Some lucky kids! Are those motors easy to work with? I rember the Merc 60J from the 1980's was very finiky and hard to set up & prop. I hated to see the OMC replace the venerable KG4-H, but one advantage it offered was the ability to run in J Class with a restrictor plate and then "step up" to A when ready. Still, something about that Johnrude fishing motor on a race boat just did not look right to my biased Mercury eyes...
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Re: Joms members at the races

Postby Genel » Fri Apr 29, 2016 4:54 pm

Agreed, the first time I saw a new style Evinrude on a hydroplane i said UGH there goes the neighborhood!!
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Re: Joms members at the races

Postby LarryR » Fri Apr 29, 2016 10:15 pm

I think the merc15s are easy once you get used to a few difference from the older engines.
Report on the carb:
Took it off and inspected the reeds - look, feel and sound (pop! x6) perfect.
checked the float height - can't get closer to 1-in without a laser.
checked the inlet needle with a loupe - no apparent wear.
The needle seat doesn't appear to be removable - at least it wasn't apparent to me and is not mentioned in the shop manual.
Although I have a new factory needle, I didn't like the idea of changing it without changing the seat (old school faulty thinking?)
Everything looked very clean, as you'd expect for a 1-year old carb with less than 50 heats (150 laps) and 100% aviation fuel.
little merc shop, Londonderry, NH; 1946 thru 1961 merc restoration :)
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Re: Joms members at the races

Postby Fastjeff » Sat Apr 30, 2016 12:06 am

Seen a bunch of newer carbs with pressed in, non-replacable seats.

Jeff
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Re: Joms members at the races

Postby bh/ » Sat Apr 30, 2016 12:45 am

larry;  -a long shot, but thinking back to my 2 cycle m/c days,
and running hi-lead Sunoco 260
[and there is still a lot of lead in that AV100]
we had trouble with 'whiskering'
on the plug gap under hi-torque  mid range loads,  ie; +hi P&T,

I use AV100 religiously in my 44s WITH no issues, but those little ones ????
Maybe try some 'boat gas',  if u have it up there ?
All else fails go after the ignition ;
but who am i to tell u, eh   :roll:
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Re: Joms members at the races

Postby LarryR » Mon May 09, 2016 5:02 pm

We have previously used MOGAS in this engine (93-oct 0L 0E)
We were using 100LL at Jesup, due to our local field having no MOGAS.
The plugs had no debris that I could see, but we'll keep your post in mind.
We'll have 12-gal of MOGAS for Standish and Milton - I called the field this morning.
We're going testing tomorrow.
thanks, LarryR
little merc shop, Londonderry, NH; 1946 thru 1961 merc restoration :)
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Re: Joms members at the races

Postby bh/ » Tue May 10, 2016 2:08 am

Standish Maine Icebreaker Regatta
Testing May 20
Racing May 21 & 22.
-this race, Jesup GA  &  Crystal Lake NY are my favorite races in NA .

Mercs run really well there I have found.
One year I ran there, the ice went off only a week earlier.
I was in the water pitting all after noon and my knees
would not bend when I got out.
All blue and frozen.
Any one in the NE should make this race at least once;
Totally friendly,  laid back,  and  real racing  icon_thumbup.gif  
I see some Larry guy is  the Race Director this year.. icon_clap.gif
Very sorry I can't be there .....    :-(
Attachments
66 Giles ME 10.jpg
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Re: Joms members at the races

Postby LarryR » Tue May 10, 2016 8:48 pm

A note on the testing at Standish::  You must have an APBA license to test on Friday.  This is an insurance rule.
Eli's mom will be selling $20 slots for testing (to cover the cost of the EMT's), but as she is not an APBA official she cannot sell you a "one-day" license.
We're trying to find someone later in the afternoon who can do so, but it ain't lookin' too good.
This will NOT be an issue on Saturday/Sunday as officials will be available.

Now, 10-May testing on Eli's AXR setup.  We went to Beaver Puddle at 1:00 PM today.
Eli's Dad took the helm, as without lead, he's only 10-lb heavier than Eli with AX lead.  (I hate skinny people  :oops: )
1st run was pretty much just at it ran at Jesup; and the result was similar except the weak output only lasted 10-sec - but it was clearly the same sound change when it came out of it.  Dave as able to reproduce it again by letting off the throttle an almost going off plane before accelerating.  It was definitely mis-behaving repeatably.
Resisting the urge to change something major, we just changed to new plugs for the next run.
2nd run was fine, sound was good from the recoil.  Zip up on plane and could not reproduce the off throttle mis-behavior.
3rd run was a repeat of #2 to make sure we didn't "miss" it.  No problem, again.

So, although we are reluctant to see success quite this easy, we're going to assume it's fixed until we test again this Saturday.
The new plugs could be masking a weak coil or switch-box.  The old plugs looked good.  Very good, in fact.
The focus will be on little brother Quin, but we'll also send Eli out to test engine heights and tuck with the AXR.  We're leaving Eli's J engine in the barn.
little merc shop, Londonderry, NH; 1946 thru 1961 merc restoration :)
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Re: Joms members at the races

Postby LarryR » Tue May 17, 2016 7:25 pm

New rule.  

Yes, you must have an APBA one day license to run.
Yes, you must have it to test on Friday.
BUT, We CAN sell you either a one day or 2016 season license in the pits   icon_clap.gif  icon_clap.gif
Look for Eli's mom near the white Freeman Farms Racing trailer near the scales.

Come on down and watch the races at Kawanis Beach on Watchic Pond in Standish off Maine Rte 25.
little merc shop, Londonderry, NH; 1946 thru 1961 merc restoration :)
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Re: Joms members at the races

Postby LarryR » Tue May 17, 2016 7:35 pm

Sure enough, after testing the AX on a new runabout several laps on Saturday last, the "low power problem" started again and got worse fast.
We changed switch boxes and found no improvement.  
The plugs look exactly the same and are a little lean (very little time on these plugs)  No signs of any lead debris.
OTOH, Quin's new engine (collection of parts) seems to run well on it's fresh rings.  Pops him right up on plane.

Yesterday we took the carburetor off and replaced the fuel pump, check valve & enrichment diaphragm.
All looked to be in perfect condition.  
Then (without further testing) we swapped the entire carb with the brand new carb on Quin's J engine.
Plan to test again tomorrow.

We have not changed the stator (shows 290+ volts under all conditions, including when it's running weak under load) or coils (both plugs are identical)
Ideas   :?:  :?:
little merc shop, Londonderry, NH; 1946 thru 1961 merc restoration :)
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Re: Joms members at the races

Postby daveswaves » Tue May 17, 2016 10:36 pm

Cross firing???
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Re: Joms members at the races

Postby Tom Brockmeyer » Tue May 17, 2016 11:01 pm

Brandon Juby has not quoted me here (yet!?) so I'll just say it:  "It's the stator... It's always the stator!"

Tom
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Re: Joms members at the races

Postby Fastjeff » Tue May 17, 2016 11:23 pm

That sounds like a variation on the classic Vince Lombardi quote: "The knee, always the knee!"

Jeff
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Re: Joms members at the races

Postby LarryR » Thu May 19, 2016 1:12 am

Tom Brockmeyer wrote:Brandon Juby has not quoted me here (yet!?) so I'll just say it:  "It's the stator... It's always the stator!"

Tom


It has been replaced prior to tomorrow's testing.  Thank you.
little merc shop, Londonderry, NH; 1946 thru 1961 merc restoration :)
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Re: Joms members at the races

Postby LarryR » Fri May 27, 2016 2:31 pm

After changing everything on the outside, Eli and I pulled it down to the crankshaft after school on Wednesday.
The culprit is a toasted center-main bearing :!: .  It spun reluctantly when cool and locked up tight (insert favorite simile here) when hot.
The outer race is bright blue black.

I checked  the ring gaps and put it back together with new center and bottom bearings, five new seals and four new rod bolts.

Waiting new Delrin motor mounts from Brown Tool and then testing.  We sure do have a lot of spare electrics now  :eek: .

The root cause :?:   Dunno, but two folks have warned me off AMSOIL DOMINATOR.  Here we go again, the old 2-c oil controversy.  
We're presently undecided, but I put it together with lots of Lubriplate and Quicksilver Premium Plus, as always.
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Re: Joms members at the races

Postby LarryR » Wed Jun 08, 2016 11:27 pm

We tested both of Eli's engines on our "Wally runabout"  at Lake Horace today.
No Lake Gestapo  icon_clap.gif

The AX engine that had the problem at Jesup with new bearings at the center and bottom main locations.
The J engine has a couple of minor repairs, including a falling-apart enrichment lever.  Plus it was over-reved badly  :eek:  on it's last heat at Standish.

Both engines seem strong and ready for Milton this weekend.  icon_thumbup.gif

We ran the AX for three heats of three laps around our little bay and Eli reported no lack of power or hints of the former issues.
We did all this with 33:1 Quicksilver Premium Plus and 0L AVGAS.  We still haven't decided on our long-term oil brand.
little merc shop, Londonderry, NH; 1946 thru 1961 merc restoration :)
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Re: Joms members at the races

Postby AU52N » Thu Jun 09, 2016 9:54 pm

Not sure this is the right place to post but the title says JOMS members at the races.  Two weekends ago the National Boat Racing Association (NBRA) sanctioned their first race of the year in Alexandria LA.  The generally the race was very nice.
My nephew came in first on Sunday in E Mod and second in D Hydro on Saturday.  Attached is a picture of the E Hydro.  It is a 44 CI Merc modified by Doug Kay on a Steve Rostkowski boat.
Alan D Mod.JPG
E Mod Tunks 2016


We did have one incident that was a little scary, the week before the race an old racer Dr. Glen Nelson, a friend ours pasted on.  Doc Nelson was a large contributor to the NBRA and the LBRA have contributed nearly half the cost of the new digital clock we used here for the first time.  His race team did make the trip down from Minnesota with a bunch of boats.  While testing their new runabout, either D or E Mod the boat disintegrated into many pieces,  the driver received a bruised knee but the new engine was no where to be found.  They tried diving and grappling for it but when I left on Sunday night it still had not been located.

David
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Re: Joms members at the races

Postby Tom Brockmeyer » Thu Jun 09, 2016 10:11 pm

AU52N wrote:Not sure this is the right place to post but the title says JOMS members at the races. -David


Hi David,  Right place to post but the "wrong picture"...   We are looking for pictures of JOMS members at the races.  See if you can pull up any of you & Alan from Tunk's and post them here. (NOT the one from 3am in Tunk's parking lot with John M & Ty Hebert doing wheelbarrow races...  Not saying it happened, I just don't wanna see a picture of it!   :D  )
Lake Lanier, 30miles North of Atlanta, GA
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Re: Joms members at the races

Postby AU52N » Fri Jun 10, 2016 6:36 pm

Tom, that is a picture of my nephew racing our boat and engine and I was there.  So it is a picture taken by a JOMS member at the races of his rig racing.  If I was in the boat they would need a crane to get me out of the boat.

David
Last edited by AU52N on Fri Jun 10, 2016 6:57 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Joms members at the races

Postby Tom Brockmeyer » Fri Jun 10, 2016 6:48 pm

AU52N wrote:  If I was in the boat they would need a crane to get me out of the boat. -David


Wow, I know that feeling, Dave...  In Ocoee I went out of the boat in a first heat, but made the second heat and ran hard.  When I got to the pits I about had to roll off the deck, into the water, THEN stand up!
Lake Lanier, 30miles North of Atlanta, GA
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Re: Joms members at the races

Postby LarryR » Tue Jun 21, 2016 11:18 pm

Do you have any idea why the runabout "disintegrated"?
We (by 'we', I mean a fellow SSOA member) had a D Hydro come apart at Milton a few years ago.  
It took about 6-days to locate the engine and that took grappling the steering gear, which was still attached.
The debris shows (in my opinion) inadequate dispersion of adhesive in the floor - plywood to foam-core.

By the way, 4-cyl merc racers (and their uncles)  are welcome on here, as far as I'm concerned.
little merc shop, Londonderry, NH; 1946 thru 1961 merc restoration :)
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Re: Joms members at the races

Postby Fastjeff » Wed Jun 22, 2016 9:16 am

Got theory on that:  Some boat builders rely mainly n the strength of the adhesive to hold the plywood to the battens.  The problem with that approach, as I see it, is that only the outer ply of the plywood is attached.  If one uses screws/ nails, then all 3 to 5 plies are attached.

Jeff
Words spoken in two stroke heaven: There's no fuel like an oiled fuel.
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Re: Joms members at the races

Postby Jeff Register » Wed Jun 22, 2016 4:26 pm

[size=150]I know very little compared to anyone else but, I'm so happy to see the father & son racers running together. Thank you everyone! I got yelled at for putting a Mac motor on my go cart at 13 or 14.  After that any hot rodding work was done elsewhere.
Jeff
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Re: Joms members at the races

Postby LarryR » Wed Jun 22, 2016 6:29 pm

Fastjeff wrote:Got theory on that:  Some boat builders rely mainly n the strength of the adhesive to hold the plywood to the battens.  The problem with that approach, as I see it, is that only the outer ply of the plywood is attached.  If one uses screws/ nails, then all 3 to 5 plies are attached.

Jeff


This makes sense, I think.  Bob O'Conner uses long skinny staples, which applies a better and more uniform pressure to the adhesive bond than clamps.
He claims that it is perfectly safe to remove the staples, but he never does.
Of course, this doesn't answer the specific question of why this particular boat "disintegrated"
little merc shop, Londonderry, NH; 1946 thru 1961 merc restoration :)
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Re: Joms members at the races

Postby Tom Brockmeyer » Wed Jun 22, 2016 7:12 pm

Stapling a boat skin on and removing the staples after the glue dries makes for a MUCH easier repair job later (you can use a router, sander, drills, grinders, etc without tearing them up on staples or nails.

They are "Race Boats"...  If they win alot without staples, then everyone will remove their staples.
Lake Lanier, 30miles North of Atlanta, GA
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Re: Joms members at the races

Postby AU52N » Wed Jun 22, 2016 7:23 pm

I was watching as the boat came apart from the pits.  The was brand new and had a newly built Doug Kay 40 CI engine.  It was running very strong.  The boat was very light weight construction, needed 86 pounds of lead to make D weight with a driver I would guess that weighed about 160 pounds.  The boat blew apart just as the driver set it into turn 3.  From the little that I heard rumored in the pits was that the side blew out water gushed in and l blew it apart.  My thoughts, but on conjecture, is that the weight shifted and blew out the side.  I could be all wrong and to my knowledge the engine has not been found.  The boat was in 1000's of pieces.
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Re: Joms members at the races

Postby Michael » Wed Jun 22, 2016 8:17 pm

AU52N wrote:I was watching as the boat came apart from the pits.  The was brand new and had a newly built Doug Kay 40 CI engine.  It was running very strong.  The boat was very light weight construction, needed 86 pounds of lead to make D weight with a driver I would guess that weighed about 160 pounds.  The boat blew apart just as the driver set it into turn 3.  From the little that I heard rumored in the pits was that the side blew out water gushed in and l blew it apart.  My thoughts, but on conjecture, is that the weight shifted and blew out the side.  I could be all wrong and to my knowledge the engine has not been found.  The boat was in 1000's of pieces.


sorry to hear about that,kinda harsh, it being a new boat
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