67 merc 1100ss

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67 merc 1100ss

Postby daveswaves » Wed Jan 10, 2018 2:16 am

20180109_112416.jpg
Finally in my shop.
Numbers matching 67 1100ss, early 67.  Turns smoothly, will be coming apart for seals, check crank bearings etc.  Would probably run right now but I will inspect first.
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Re: 67 merc 1100ss

Postby daveswaves » Wed Jan 10, 2018 2:23 am

20180109_112439.jpg
20180109_112954.jpg
20180109_113013.jpg
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Re: 67 merc 1100ss

Postby daveswaves » Wed Jan 10, 2018 2:43 am

The whale tail of course will go.  Pulled plugs and they showed very rich.  I dont tnink this was ever run hard, apparently the previous owner felt it was too big for his boat.
Will split the block and inspect but it is very smooth and I dont expect any issues.  I will change seals for sure and bearings if there is the slightest tic.
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Re: 67 merc 1100ss

Postby Fingerlakeskid » Wed Jan 10, 2018 4:56 am

Nice Dave, looks like a real sweetheart!
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Re: 67 merc 1100ss

Postby dave bernard » Wed Jan 10, 2018 5:06 am

If it has perma gap plugs they will look rich and be normal.
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Re: 67 merc 1100ss

Postby zul8tr » Wed Jan 10, 2018 11:14 am

Nice. To know where it presently is I would measure crank end play before changing bearings and seals. I like to measure with a dial gage at the top of the crank before pulling the flywheel.
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Re: 67 merc 1100ss

Postby Fastjeff » Wed Jan 10, 2018 11:53 am

That's  one of those bolt on cap distributors. I have the electrical portion for one of those if you waant it.


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Re: 67 merc 1100ss

Postby daveswaves » Wed Jan 10, 2018 2:45 pm

Thanks for the comments, Dave B, I never noticed that with other inline sixes with perma gaps.  Good to know.  Pete, good idea, will measure before I pull. Jeff, dont throw it away lol, Stan, a sweetheart she will be.
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Re: 67 merc 1100ss

Postby daveswaves » Thu Jan 11, 2018 10:39 pm

Powerhead is off, ready to move downstairs.   icon_thumbup.gif
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Re: 67 merc 1100ss

Postby white-merc » Thu Jan 11, 2018 11:49 pm

You sure aren't wasting time Dave!. It must be thawed out now.
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Re: 67 merc 1100ss

Postby daveswaves » Fri Jan 12, 2018 12:30 am

Yes it sorta thawed out, I could not spin it fast enough to get a good compression reading on it.  Turning the block and the lower at these temperatures isjust too much work lol.  I will pull the lower too and check it out down stairs. icon_thumbup.gif
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Re: 67 merc 1100ss

Postby mercaholic » Fri Jan 12, 2018 3:14 pm

Nice find Dave.
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Re: 67 merc 1100ss

Postby daveswaves » Fri Jan 12, 2018 10:37 pm

Was able to do a good compression check on the 1100ss block.  118 to 120 across the board.  I pulled the intake covers and there is no rust or scoring and the rings all have spring in their step.  At this pont I see no reason to crack the block open.  I will remove all the add ons (carbs starter etc) paint the block and call it good.  Even the lower seals passed a vacuum and pressure check.  This is a very low hours engine.
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Re: 67 merc 1100ss

Postby daveswaves » Fri Jan 12, 2018 11:39 pm

Other notables during disassembly , distributor drive belt relatively new, no cracking.  Main fuel hose had been replaced with mercury hose in 2005. Date on hose.  One trigger wire frayed and hanging on by a single strand.  Mercury switch wires rotted and 12v red wire rotted, brown tach wire rotted.  This is normal stuff and much better than most I have seen.  Somebody thought it would be a good idea to glue the coil lead into the coil. A few long bolts were used where short ones are required. One broken cowl bolt and broken rubber mount.  
Carbs will come off tomorrow.
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Re: 67 merc 1100ss

Postby turtles11756 » Sat Jan 13, 2018 2:53 am

i have same engine here found it cheap ($50.00) . shift shaft rusted thru just above female end splines. i have new shaft someday may get around to it . lead seal still on one of the bolts holding distributor cap. brown wire out of dist. cap crumpling. a friend came with me to pick it up in NJ years ago. he was laughing at me on the way home "your paying for junk in somebody's yard" 129 psi thru 138 all six. he has stopped laughing at my old mercs
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Re: 67 merc 1100ss

Postby daveswaves » Sun Jan 14, 2018 1:23 am

Carbs and fuel pumps are off and dissassembled.  There was no sign of fuel anywhere.  Fuel bowls were clean, fuel pumps had a little rust and white powder.  All will clean up nicely.  New floats and needles and seats are already there.  Somebody spent some money on this at a mercury service shop. [wrench.gif] ,  I decided to split the halfs after all, I heard a dry squeek in there that I want to check out. [canada.gif]
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Re: 67 merc 1100ss

Postby daveswaves » Sun Jan 14, 2018 10:07 pm

Well my intuition was right.  The dry squeek was caused by RUST [front.gif] .  the engine had no oil film on the intake side.  A lesson to those in our freeze and fry climates.  Use fogging oil before you put it away.  I will dissassemble the complete crank assembly and check for pitting.
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20180114_151908.jpg
Poor storage conditions
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Re: 67 merc 1100ss

Postby daveswaves » Sun Jan 14, 2018 10:12 pm

Heres a look at the pistons, there are a few stuck rings, none broken yet, though they may when released.  Unfortunately the new old stock pistons I bought are for small rod end rods.  This 1100 has large end.
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20180114_153100.jpg
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Re: 67 merc 1100ss

Postby daveswaves » Sun Jan 14, 2018 10:15 pm

This last one is a puzzle for your speculation.  Identify the symptom and the cause from this photo. Piston number 1 not number 2.
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Re: 67 merc 1100ss

Postby dave bernard » Sun Jan 14, 2018 10:17 pm

never mind the piston look at the GAP between the needles.
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Re: 67 merc 1100ss

Postby Michael » Sun Jan 14, 2018 10:23 pm

I saw that too Dave the bearing gap shows well even on a small cell phone screen
is it firing past the rings just above the wrist pin? elliptical bore? I cant really tell on this small cell phone screen, Im going to look again when I get home

great job Dave bet your glad you opened it up  :arrow:
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Re: 67 merc 1100ss

Postby daveswaves » Sun Jan 14, 2018 10:32 pm

Bingo Dave and Michael.  There is a bearing missing.  All other rods have the correct amount.  The skirt is polished [yeahthat.gif] .  rattle city.
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Re: 67 merc 1100ss

Postby daveswaves » Sun Jan 14, 2018 10:39 pm

I post this stuff to show why its always worth it to tear down.  Initially the compression was even if a bit low at 120.  I could feel the glitch when rotating by hand.  Then I heard the squeek.
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Re: 67 merc 1100ss

Postby biglargeone » Sun Jan 14, 2018 11:00 pm

I 100 % agree. I saw a guy buy a motor that sat for a long spell. He fogged the snot out of it while turning over to lube it yup, did basic maintenance and fired it up. On the boat it ran great, for a short period of time and then it grenaded [front.gif] Probably had a little rust on crank that could have been polished off easily.
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Re: 67 merc 1100ss

Postby Fingerlakeskid » Sun Jan 14, 2018 11:22 pm

Better to be safe than sorry. You wanted a winter project anyway, right Dave?
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Re: 67 merc 1100ss

Postby daveswaves » Sun Jan 14, 2018 11:32 pm

Fingerlakeskid wrote:Better to be safe than sorry. You wanted a winter project anyway, right Dave?

Yup, I now have 16 inline pistons to shove into a block, or three.   [wrench.gif]
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Re: 67 merc 1100ss

Postby daveswaves » Mon Jan 15, 2018 12:31 am

zul8tr wrote:Nice. To know where it presently is I would measure crank end play before changing bearings and seals. I like to measure with a dial gage at the top of the crank before pulling the flywheel.

Hey Pete, was going to do that but with the flexplate style flywheel no where to mount magnetic mount for the dial indicator.  Since I now have it apart I will replace the bearings anyway and then shim accordingly.
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Re: 67 merc 1100ss

Postby daveswaves » Sun Jan 28, 2018 3:35 am

20180114_153052.jpg
A nice crank is on its way from salt lake city to road salt central( Ontario).  Now that that is on its way I will start refurbishing the block and pistons, ready for assembly.  The cyl walls are glazed a bit and there are a few minor scores where the pistons scuffed a bit.  Two pistons have the rings stuck on the exhaust side but they are savable.  I will hand dress the ring area and wire wheel the skirts to put the circumference detail back.  Ez does it.
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Re: 67 merc 1100ss

Postby daveswaves » Fri Feb 02, 2018 9:24 pm

Powerhead is re conditioned ready for the crank when it arrives.  Check out how the cyl measures where number one was flailing around! 2.939.  Spec is 2.938.  I will take it.
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Re: 67 merc 1100ss

Postby daveswaves » Fri Feb 02, 2018 10:03 pm

20180202_095407.jpg
76 merc 850
I put this merc 850 together while waiting for my crank.
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Re: 67 merc 1100ss

Postby zul8tr » Fri Feb 02, 2018 11:00 pm

daveswaves wrote:Powerhead is re conditioned ready for the crank when it arrives.  Check out how the cyl measures where number one was flailing around! 2.939.  Spec is 2.938.  I will take it.


Dave based on skirt at 2.927 in table and 2.939 your measure that's .012" clear, isn't that a bit loose? I assume the skirt table values are measured at the usual location for clearance measurements  :?:

Do you have those tables for 2 cylinder jobs like Merc 200 of the 1970's
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Re: 67 merc 1100ss

Postby daveswaves » Fri Feb 02, 2018 11:11 pm

zul8tr wrote:
daveswaves wrote:Powerhead is re conditioned ready for the crank when it arrives.  Check out how the cyl measures where number one was flailing around! 2.939.  Spec is 2.938.  I will take it.


Dave based on skirt at 2.927 in table and 2.939 your measure that's .012" clear, isn't that a bit loose? I assume the skirt table values are measured at the usual location for clearance measurements  :?:

Do you have those tables for 2 cylinder jobs like Merc 200 of the 1970's

That's .006 clearance, each side.  Original spec is .0055 per side.  The original spec for the bore is 2.938, with all the gouges taken out I am .001 bigger.  Not going to bore for that.  I may consider coating the skirts to tighten it up a bit.
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Re: 67 merc 1100ss

Postby daveswaves » Sat Feb 03, 2018 12:02 am

20180202_174058.jpg
Here's a chart for some of the 2 cyl stuff.
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Re: 67 merc 1100ss

Postby zul8tr » Sat Feb 03, 2018 12:22 am

daveswaves wrote:
zul8tr wrote:
daveswaves wrote:Powerhead is re conditioned ready for the crank when it arrives.  Check out how the cyl measures where number one was flailing around! 2.939.  Spec is 2.938.  I will take it.


Dave based on skirt at 2.927 in table and 2.939 your measure that's .012" clear, isn't that a bit loose? I assume the skirt table values are measured at the usual location for clearance measurements  :?:

Do you have those tables for 2 cylinder jobs like Merc 200 of the 1970's

That's .006 clearance, each side.  Original spec is .0055 per side.  The original spec for the bore is 2.938, with all the gouges taken out I am .001 bigger.  Not going to bore for that.  I may consider coating the skirts to tighten it up a bit.


Now that's interesting. The Merc 200 standard bore is 2.565" and 2.558" skirt for 0.007" total clear which is typical for that size bore and about what my 25ss runs. Having never built the larger bore L6's I was just surprised at the much larger 0.012" clearance of which you are just a tad more and no issue.

Where did you get these tables  :?:
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Re: 67 merc 1100ss

Postby daveswaves » Sat Feb 03, 2018 12:41 am

I believe the i6 pistons grow more than the little guys.  The i6 is also a cold block, it does not heat up as quickly as the piston does.  Gotta leave room for that.  We used to run into problems with wiseco forged pistons since they grow faster than the cast ones and you could stick them before you left the marina if you were not careful.  The newer wiseco are slightly different metalurgy and don't have that problem.  Wiseco used to reccomend an additional .001 clearance when using their pistons in an inline.  Of course nobody ever read that little note.
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Re: 67 merc 1100ss

Postby daveswaves » Sat Feb 03, 2018 12:44 am

The charts I collected over the years.  The last chart came from Laddies on i boats back in 2006.
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Re: 67 merc 1100ss

Postby zul8tr » Sat Feb 03, 2018 10:40 am

daveswaves wrote:The charts I collected over the years.  The last chart came from Laddies on i boats back in 2006.


What about posting them in the White pages ?
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Re: 67 merc 1100ss

Postby daveswaves » Sat Feb 03, 2018 11:39 pm

I will convert them to more readable text and send them to whitepapers.
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Re: 67 merc 1100ss

Postby Michael » Sun Feb 04, 2018 6:47 am

daveswaves wrote:I will convert them to more readable text and send them to whitepapers.



its a perfect time,  I have 1/3 of the whitepaper files converted to html5  already
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Re: 67 merc 1100ss

Postby Fastjeff » Sun Feb 04, 2018 7:58 pm

Just thought of this: Was this Merc 1100 the largest of Merc's old design, cross flow motors?

Jeff
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Re: 67 merc 1100ss

Postby daveswaves » Mon Feb 05, 2018 12:53 am

I believe so Jeff, the 1150 1250 1350 were all direct charge.
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Re: 67 merc 1100ss

Postby 1500J » Tue Feb 06, 2018 4:01 am

Fastjeff wrote:Just thought of this: Was this Merc 1100 the largest of Merc's old design, cross flow motors?

Jeff


The 1250 was the largest old cross flow.  The 1250 was the first 99 cube motor -  it also was the last of the old conventional cross flow using the old piston design.   So it is a one of a kind.  

The 1100 and the 1250 share the award of being two year only designs before moving on to better things.

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Re: 67 merc 1100ss

Postby daveswaves » Tue Feb 06, 2018 7:22 pm

Thanks Conrad, I had forgotten about that.  
Update on the 1100ss, my crank has arrived in Port Huron Michigan so I just have to organize a trip over the Bluewater bridge to pick it up.  While I was waiting I decided to clean up the two pistons that were scored up, 3 and 5.  I cleaned up 3, removed the ridges from the gouging and cleaned up the ring lands.  Once clean I found the original reason for the damage.  The ring pin in the top groove was pushed into the piston and had no protrusion.   So I checked 5.  Sure enough the pin was pushed in on that one too.  The other 4 are fine.  This was not a factory sealed unit and I noticed other evidence that it had been worked on.  In this case the top ring was not registered with the pin when they stuffed the piston in [yeahthat.gif] .  

I will now need to used the two new pistons with the small piston pin that I purchased just in case.  Unfortunately I will have to find rods from an early 950 or 1000. To complete the build.  Literature on the 67 1100ss mentions upgraded rods.  My sleuthing to date suggests that the 66 1100 used the older 1000 rods and the 67 used the later 1000 rods.
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Re: 67 merc 1100ss

Postby 1500J » Wed Feb 07, 2018 3:36 pm

I hope you can pinpoint when the large pin came into play.

Wonder if those pin holes are extra deep.  And if the motor ever gets a little too warm those locator pins can move back into the hole?
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Re: 67 merc 1100ss

Postby daveswaves » Wed Feb 07, 2018 8:54 pm

They are certainly deep enough to accept the pin lol.  Here are some more pics of the internals on this engine.  I share because I have never seen this in any engines I have pulled down.  See the crack??
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Re: 67 merc 1100ss

Postby daveswaves » Wed Feb 07, 2018 8:58 pm

They are certainly deep enough to accept the pin lol.  Here are some more pics of thw internals on this engine.  I share because I have never seen this in any engines I have pulled down.  See the crack??
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Re: 67 merc 1100ss

Postby daveswaves » Wed Feb 07, 2018 9:01 pm

Heres another pic of the tip of the reeds. You can see where the end broke.  1100ss.
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Re: 67 merc 1100ss

Postby daveswaves » Wed Feb 07, 2018 9:07 pm

Finally, an answer to " how did they get that extra 10 hp anyway?"  see the difference in the reed blocks.  One is a 1000 the other is the 1100.  The reeds on the 1000 are different too.  They are tapered at the hinge point, matching the shape of the reed block.  They also have a Channel machined out under the reed tip to act as a damper when the reed closes.
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Re: 67 merc 1100ss

Postby daveswaves » Wed Feb 07, 2018 10:28 pm

1500J wrote:I hope you can pinpoint when the large pin cae?


Conrad I think I have it nailed down, 1964 1000 was the small pin as well as the 64 650.  Part number for the rod I believe is 611 1885A2.  Casting number on the rod beam is 611 1746.
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Re: 67 merc 1100ss

Postby 1500J » Wed Feb 07, 2018 10:53 pm

The 650 bumped up in cubic inches around the same time as the 1100 I think.

That crack is interesting.  Wonder if the mating surfaces are not parallel then spread when tightened down.

Chipped reads I think happened with this era of motor.  I think that is one of the reasons the recommended RPM is conservative during this generation.   Once the 1250 style (shorter and more of them) and newer reeds came into play they ran harder without failure.   I think the guys that raced these 1100's high RPM changed out their reeds to a plastic/fiber reed that survived the high RPM.

My 1965 650 had HUGE openings in the reed cage if you want some random info.  My 900 had smaller.

I ran my 1965 900 hard and got chipped tips.  Ive run my 1250 1500's hard and never chipped tips.
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